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Track A: Algorithms, Complexity and Games

DOI: 10.4230/LIPIcs.ICALP.2025.22

New Bounds for the Ideal Proof System in Positive Characteristic

Authors: Amik Raj Behera, Nutan Limaye, Varun Ramanathan, and Srikanth Srinivasan

Published in: LIPIcs, Volume 334, 52nd International Colloquium on Automata, Languages, and Programming (ICALP 2025)

Abstract

In this work, we prove upper and lower bounds over fields of positive characteristics for several fragments of the Ideal Proof System (IPS), an algebraic proof system introduced by Grochow and Pitassi (J. ACM 2018). Our results extend the works of Forbes, Shpilka, Tzameret, and Wigderson (Theory of Computing 2021) and also of Govindasamy, Hakoniemi, and Tzameret (FOCS 2022). These works primarily focused on proof systems over fields of characteristic 0, and we are able to extend these results to positive characteristic. The question of proving general IPS lower bounds over positive characteristic is motivated by the important question of proving AC⁰[p]-Frege lower bounds. This connection was observed by Grochow and Pitassi (J. ACM 2018). Additional motivation comes from recent developments in algebraic complexity theory due to Forbes (CCC 2024) who showed how to extend previous lower bounds over characteristic 0 to positive characteristic. In our work, we adapt the functional lower bound method of Forbes et al. (Theory of Computing 2021) to prove exponential-size lower bounds for various subsystems of IPS. In order to establish these size lower bounds, we first prove a tight degree lower bound for a variant of Subset Sum over positive characteristic. This forms the core of all our lower bounds. Additionally, we derive upper bounds for the instances presented above. We show that they have efficient constant-depth IPS refutations. This demonstrates that constant-depth IPS refutations are stronger than the proof systems considered above even in positive characteristic. We also show that constant-depth IPS can efficiently refute a general class of instances, namely all symmetric instances, thereby further uncovering the strength of these algebraic proofs in positive characteristic.

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Amik Raj Behera, Nutan Limaye, Varun Ramanathan, and Srikanth Srinivasan. New Bounds for the Ideal Proof System in Positive Characteristic. In 52nd International Colloquium on Automata, Languages, and Programming (ICALP 2025). Leibniz International Proceedings in Informatics (LIPIcs), Volume 334, pp. 22:1-22:20, Schloss Dagstuhl – Leibniz-Zentrum für Informatik (2025)

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@InProceedings{behera_et_al:LIPIcs.ICALP.2025.22,
  author =	{Behera, Amik Raj and Limaye, Nutan and Ramanathan, Varun and Srinivasan, Srikanth},
  title =	{{New Bounds for the Ideal Proof System in Positive Characteristic}},
  booktitle =	{52nd International Colloquium on Automata, Languages, and Programming (ICALP 2025)},
  pages =	{22:1--22:20},
  series =	{Leibniz International Proceedings in Informatics (LIPIcs)},
  ISBN =	{978-3-95977-372-0},
  ISSN =	{1868-8969},
  year =	{2025},
  volume =	{334},
  editor =	{Censor-Hillel, Keren and Grandoni, Fabrizio and Ouaknine, Jo\"{e}l and Puppis, Gabriele},
  publisher =	{Schloss Dagstuhl -- Leibniz-Zentrum f{\"u}r Informatik},
  address =	{Dagstuhl, Germany},
  URL =		{https://drops.dagstuhl.de/entities/document/10.4230/LIPIcs.ICALP.2025.22},
  URN =		{urn:nbn:de:0030-drops-233992},
  doi =		{10.4230/LIPIcs.ICALP.2025.22},
  annote =	{Keywords: Ideal Proof Systems, Algebraic Complexity, Positive Characteristic}
}

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DOI: 10.4230/LIPIcs.MFCS.2019.29

The Quantifier Alternation Hierarchy of Synchronous Relations

Authors: Diego Figueira, Varun Ramanathan, and Pascal Weil

Published in: LIPIcs, Volume 138, 44th International Symposium on Mathematical Foundations of Computer Science (MFCS 2019)

Abstract

The class of synchronous relations, also known as automatic or regular, is one of the most studied subclasses of rational relations. It enjoys many desirable closure properties and is known to be logically characterized: the synchronous relations are exactly those that are defined by a first-order formula on the structure of all finite words, with the prefix, equal-length and last-letter predicates. Here, we study the quantifier alternation hierarchy of this logic. We show that it collapses at level Sigma_3 and that all levels below admit decidable characterizations. Our results reveal the connections between this hierarchy and the well-known hierarchy of first-order defined languages of finite words.

Cite as

Diego Figueira, Varun Ramanathan, and Pascal Weil. The Quantifier Alternation Hierarchy of Synchronous Relations. In 44th International Symposium on Mathematical Foundations of Computer Science (MFCS 2019). Leibniz International Proceedings in Informatics (LIPIcs), Volume 138, pp. 29:1-29:14, Schloss Dagstuhl – Leibniz-Zentrum für Informatik (2019)

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@InProceedings{figueira_et_al:LIPIcs.MFCS.2019.29,
  author =	{Figueira, Diego and Ramanathan, Varun and Weil, Pascal},
  title =	{{The Quantifier Alternation Hierarchy of Synchronous Relations}},
  booktitle =	{44th International Symposium on Mathematical Foundations of Computer Science (MFCS 2019)},
  pages =	{29:1--29:14},
  series =	{Leibniz International Proceedings in Informatics (LIPIcs)},
  ISBN =	{978-3-95977-117-7},
  ISSN =	{1868-8969},
  year =	{2019},
  volume =	{138},
  editor =	{Rossmanith, Peter and Heggernes, Pinar and Katoen, Joost-Pieter},
  publisher =	{Schloss Dagstuhl -- Leibniz-Zentrum f{\"u}r Informatik},
  address =	{Dagstuhl, Germany},
  URL =		{https://drops.dagstuhl.de/entities/document/10.4230/LIPIcs.MFCS.2019.29},
  URN =		{urn:nbn:de:0030-drops-109735},
  doi =		{10.4230/LIPIcs.MFCS.2019.29},
  annote =	{Keywords: synchronous relations, automatic relations, first-order logic, characterization, quantifier alternation}
}

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Documents authored by Ramanathan, Varun

New Bounds for the Ideal Proof System in Positive Characteristic

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The Quantifier Alternation Hierarchy of Synchronous Relations

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